all right welcome back to fortitude everybody we got a doozy for you today i’m jw that’s brinton thank you cat
welcome to the cap tech studio we are fortitude fw fw ford fw
i literally butchered that fortitude fw.com we’ll have to go to the editing floor for that mistake uh thanks for
joining us folks brinton we got us a badass in the house mr danny
coulson welcome danny to the show thank you both awesome danny is the former
deputy assistant director of the fbi uh currently he owns a security consulting company called coulson associates but
that’s just putting his his career mildly i would say uh this man is 80 years old he just told us which is
remarkable you look fantastic by the way thank you whatever you’re doing keep doing it i didn’t look i didn’t look
fantastic when i was 30 so i know i don’t look fantastic well i’m impressed so appreciate you being here we really
appreciate it yeah thank you friends at captex bank make all this possible so they’re going to be very happy that you
stopped by the show so my pleasure um getting right to it your dad was in the military early on you didn’t want to
follow that path you wanted to be a musician you just told us you wanted to play the trumpet i did and that didn’t
pan out no i guess for a good way we ended up where you are well it didn’t pan out because i wasn’t very good i was
terrible and had no talent and uh so you know you wanna fate you know god steps in and sends you
sends you where he wants you yeah that works faith fate led you to tcu uh local local school here in town and then to
smu where you got your law degree i did you knew you wanted to be in the law at some level then then it got serious then
you were you recruited by the fbi you just joined no i was i was between semesters my senior year in law school
at smu and i went to an antique gun store called jackson arms which is still there i think
and uh there’s an fba agent in there and he said what are you gonna do with yourself i said i’m gonna go to the navy he said no you’re not
and so they started recruiting me i never thought they’d take me good lord i had i had uncles who were in prison and
i was not a great candidate so anyway they took me and i went to the academy and graduated and did they hang out at
gun stores looking for candidates like how does that no that’s interesting that’s a good question the museum asked me that um it was a stolen antique gun
case that he was working it was stolen out in west texas i remember that but anyway he
stole a whole collection and he uh was getting value so he could decide how to
prosecute these guys so they it was just a happenstance huh yeah i was actually i was sick as a dog
i’d been up for like five days studying for my finals so i didn’t study during the year i waited till the end as we all
did and uh if we had a nice conference his name was charlie brown i will never forget that wow
and the conversation started and then there it goes then you guys kind of kept in touch and well they kept you know
bringing me in for interviews and taking tests and the uh process to become an agent is pretty arduous it’s just
difficult do you ever tell you what he liked about you like what stuck out that that that he felt sorry for me i guess i was
running around looking lost or something but it was it was your knowledge in law that obviously it was enticing to the
fbi yes i think so because they recruited six guys out of my class okay and uh
um we all were all lawyers all smu grads and a couple i think ut guys
and we went to the academy and were fortunate to not get killed there and and uh survived the course and went on
uh your first assignment was sent to new haven connecticut yes you became you went undercover almost immediately
correct i did yes you speak to that for a second yeah i can i was pretty young i was pretty young but i would look like i
was like 12. and they uh put me undercover with a patriarch a
and i worked undercover for about nine months i guess resulting in some put a lot of people in
jail okay good and they tried to protect me it’s interesting um when they did the big raids and i i had everybody locked
up and they had them in a command post type and they’re all sitting there grumbling and i walked in they said
oh my god they got danny too and he said no danny got you so i was the guy that put them all away
actually they were likable guys but you know is it you know we’ve we’ve got some friends who are cops and um we just
talked about one or tegan yeah yeah and that there does seem to appear this game
that exists i mean it’s a very high stakes game no doubt but does it was it the same way there that there was this
cat and mouse it was a game you know i think so um first of all it’s a little bit lonely
because when i did it um if you got compromised they’d disavowed you i mean
they didn’t even claim you’re an agent you were just doing something yeah so it was a little bit uh dicey that way
um but i got in good with them i used to drive them around the state of connecticut and
we did our thing and we were friends and and i remember one night we were in a bowling alley
and uh there were probably 20 agents in there bowling drinking beer which they weren’t supposed to do but you know that
was a different time yeah and uh the guy was saying you know i’m glad we met up here i can smell cops well we’re not
doing too good right now but um yeah that was kind of it was it was kind of fun it’s kind of funny from
there you move on to new york city oh yeah uh then it gets i mean then you’re obviously you’re on your trajectory and
it gets it kicks up a notch but you work on police assassinations fugitives bank robbery investigations uh how long were
you doing these things for i was there in new york about seven years seven and a half years i’d done some other stuff
before that but there were a couple of cops murdered in new york city piagetini and jones
were killed in the colonial house project housing project assassinated by two individuals
and uh i i was a fugitive guy to hunted people and so they put together a team
under the direction of the president united states had had it done and they picked me because i was a i
chase people yeah how are you chasing this these individuals oh my god um first of all they were chasing us too
because they were trying to kill us while we’re trying to catch them so that was that was really dicey and um
just talk to people people i get to ask that a lot how do you catch people somebody tells you where they are yeah
you talk to enough people you throw enough things out there you jam somebody up on a crime they’ve committed
and actually the last guy we caught was a man named twyman he was the most wanted man in america
probably in the world and his wife came to me so moses crime
murder kidnapping bankruptcy all the good stuff oh yeah yeah he killed several cops how many times do you have
to do it by jamming them up like what would you say out of 100 100 you know busts
jamming them up and getting the answer of where they are or what they’re doing or how i can get them that way versus
killing them with kindness and people just opening their mouth like the wife doing that i’ve never been asked that question it’s a good question um i would
say the majority is jamming them up yeah by force just jamming them up yeah because the bureau is not strong or we
don’t we don’t beat confessions out of people whatever that kind of stuff but
um she didn’t want to go to jail for 40 years and i had her on a lot of charges and
she basically told me where he was and so we went up and had a big shootout
he didn’t he didn’t survive i did yeah my guy’s all one and he’s a tough guy i will tell you the
toughest human being i’ve ever encountered he fought me to his last breath
and um it was not easy i wasn’t pretty i was pretty strong dude and pretty good shape
and when it got down to it he was trying to get a hand grenade out of his pocket holy cow and um i had him down on the
ground and uh i had my hand on his throat i’m holding him down and he finally bled out
but um he thought he did not he didn’t roll over and suck his thumb and act
like a [ __ ] he fought me any idea that that was gonna give that kind of fight to him from when you were chasing him
like yeah you could have identified it from yeah he was a very husky guy he was a very strong guy
cops had tried to arrest him several times he got away every time okay and uh at that time they all carried
an ancient weapon called a browning high power which was given out that was i’m sorry
it was released in 1935 wow and um he got he just shoot his way
out of it he almost got us he was good to give him credit um i wasn’t giving him credit when we
were wrestling on the street but uh he’s a tough guy sir so you uh you were part of the fbi sniper team and you made one
of the most active swat teams in the fbi is that after your new york during your new york was doing the new
york deal yes um you are an uh you were a trained sniper yourself yes how what does that feel like what is
that how can you explain that to us who don’t know what that’s like well it’s like having a hobby and getting paid for
it yeah they give you the best rifles in the world and they give you the best ammunition and they expect you to shoot
it but they don’t expect you to miss right so that was fun i enjoyed that i was also a firearms instructor that was
fun too what type of shot would you say you were uh good at making i mean is it a thousand yards in your now you know in
law enforcement that is not in the cards okay we don’t take we take a couple hundred yard shots at the moment i’ll
ask you a question what do you think the longest sniper shot ever taken in the state of texas is that’s a great
question well that’s funny because i was gonna ask you there’s no place like down in stephenville where these guys train
on these mile long i mean you’re in new york city where are you going to get that far over the range right
west point okay okay okay the longest shot
in the state of texas 300 yards i have no idea probably four or 500 but i’m sure it’s a thousand or more you
guys are way off it’s like 90 yards that’s the longest most of them are like 30. really because we’re in the urban
environment right yeah yeah so the shots but the difference is pressure a lot of times there’s a hostage there
and so it’s one thing to take a shot if you miss you miss but if you got a hostage between you and the
bad guy or you know being held and uncontrolled and that’s that’s a lot more it’s a little more pressure does your
brain start going towards like looking at a target and thinking in those terms where that’s the distance between one
head and another kind of right thing no you just you just have scenarios where you have dummies and you have targets
and things and there’s a mantra you go through in your mind before you take a shot and um
um no it’s you know what it’s not as dramatic as you guys think it is watching on the movies
we just go do that and you know and uh i never had to take a site like that my guys did uh the most amazing sniper shot
in the history of bureau was taking one of hrt operators and um it’s it’s absolutely amazing what they do
but they also they practice every day yeah we shot a submachine gun a pistol rifle every day
and sometimes all three so it’s just that’s our job and that’s what we do and we don’t think much of it we just go do
it and you know we go do a job then go do another yes sir so at this time are you married or is this all work you’re
just no no i i had a little boy um my son was born on when i was on the
swat team and um that marriage did not last there’s a lot of marriages don’t
and um so but anyway i ended up as a single father um i was a single father when i
commanded the hostage rescue team which is which happened you know you was getting to that next point in 1982 you
were you’re charged with creating the hostage address you seen the hrt for the fbi please please tell us about that oh my
gosh um that was not easy um there was a couple of scenarios between
uh the military and law enforcement and and it was viewed by the white house and that after that viewing they decided two
things they knew they knew what military doing it and military said they didn’t want to do it so the director was
told you better get a team because you got that you got the mission so they had a big search thing and
they picked me for some reason and we we lost what
the hostage rescue team if you could generalize or dummify it for us who don’t know generally when there’s a
hostage situation what what are the what are the steps to get to the solution is there is there a strategy or is is
everyone different no first of all let me tell you this little background there are only three counter-terrorist teams
in the united states the delta force which you’ve heard of yes and seal team six and hrt they’ll have to be certified
joint special operation command certifies them and they’ll have the same capabilities the same mission they’ll do the same
thing there are some different entities a lot of times you’ll see a uh a rescue someplace in the world
they say it’s military a lot of times it’s our team we got movies about delta force we’ve got movies about cl26
i don’t know do we have hrt movies yeah no our our publicity people are as
good as the navy’s i guess sure uh no there’s not um and i think that’s fine yeah
so matt can you explain what happened in mountain home market so not that i have any crazy arkansas friends or anything
but maybe you tell us about that deal yeah that was a great op um i was called a fbi headquarters from our from our
office in quantico and i went up there and the deputy director is briefing me he said we’ve got a hostage situation we
have we have a team of people they’re originally religious well just excuse me
i got that from you religious fanatics and um they have a compound in mountain
home and uh they’re holding hostages they’re getting ready to kill the united states attorney and several
politicians and they’ve got claymore mines rockets night vision gear they
have an armored car and you got to go get them out all this information coming some informa or somebody in there yeah a
lot of it came from atf atf did a really good job one of my good friends is a man named bill buford and he uh he developed
all that but they couldn’t do it and uh there’s an interesting side here i was doing bill clinton’s
security in south america since he after i retired okay he left
and he asked me one day and he was the governor of arkansas yeah and he he was playing golf and he called me over to
the tee box he said danny you wonder why i wanted you boys to do that opposite no
he said i just want to see you guys work yeah and um so we did it we pulled it off and nobody got hurt and it was it
was not easy it was very difficult but um i think i think sometimes
uh god intervenes in those we’re on the right side of that one yeah and i think that’s really important in my business
that’s that’s very important and uh faith um so anyway i kind of digressed i apologize that’s okay how
much time do you have from getting that initial call and then obviously you’re coming from probably another location
to getting on the ground you know the movies rush it and and do this but
you don’t have time to go through i wouldn’t think all of the paperwork in the back story i mean well um but you
have a team this is what we do yeah it’s it’s i mean i don’t have to do any research i just tell people to do it okay um i’ll tell you you know the thing
that happened in colleyville at the jewish synagogue yes that was hrt did that oh wow i was just with them last
week and from the time they got the call to go two hours later there in the air
they got here in time to pull it off so that’s what they practice deployment they practice they have intel people
they have a a great wealth of you got the whole fbi to get your information for yeah mistakes if you can’t yeah
that’s not enough you can move fast if they need to yeah and that’s what they do they practice at all times well the
hrt you you specifically excuse me you and the hrt are credited with with over
like around 300 hostages rescued which is incredible one of those that
was not a successful rescue or there was not a guy you’re trying to rescue one of the bad guys robert j matthews from the
order oh my gosh i’m a nazi terrorist group yeah i talked to robert um that was uh would be island we were sent out
there to get him and robert was a member of the order which is i think you’ve probably
researched that you know what that is it’s a it’s basically a christian identity based uh philosophy
and uh we trapped them the hrt did a great job we trapped him in there we started negotiations i actually talked
to him a couple times and i was close enough homeless could grab him what was their goal real quick the orders were
they trying to accomplish um well they were horrible racist um they want to kill jews kill
minorities and form a new um movement here in the united states
they were pretty tough anyway um we were there for quite a while and after a while the headquarters got the
concern that we were there too long because there’s other things you have to go do and so we were pulled off
and we uh we left and uh swat team got it and they were good uh anyway the house
ended up burning down he ended up dying but on his own accord it wasn’t uh was
in the hrt that caused no no we weren’t even there we we had been removed
in 86 you were inspector in charge of the rand contra investigation so you probably dealt with ollie north a little
bit olly and i are good friends now all right i indicted how is ollie doing i love ollie um i didn’t want to do that
case i was commanding the division in washington d.c and i was asked to do it and i said no no no i turned it down
and so my uh now wife and i were rock climbing in the shenandoah park and
a team of uh state troopers came and got me and said you need to call your headquarters and so i went in and called
and they said well you’ve got around contracts no i don’t they said you’ve got about an hour to get to dc so
my wife and i drove back to dc and i took that case you know we’re watching a netflix now on
the guy he’s a pilot who flew a bunch of the arms apparently yeah
yeah he’s an arkansas guy too i think he was born and raised so well they were trying to do the right
thing they forgot we have a constitution it was just a small thing yeah and uh
i did we i i got the indictment on ollie then i left and then uh he uh we convicted ollie
and then he beat us on on appeal which we knew he would and uh then he had started his radio
show and he called my uh a publisher and said do you think danny would do my show and they said oh hell yeah
so debbie and i flew back to virginia because he was shot in virginia and kind of like this we sat there we
talked about how you know i wrongly prosecuted him and i said you beat me on technicality and it was it was it was
fun i like molly i’ve done when he had his uh daytime show i did it a lot of times i’m a big fan of ollie’s uh we
were just on the wrong side of pretty important issues so the following year in 1987 you were the tactical
commander of in the atlanta prison riots holy cow i’m this is from your it’s also in your book no heroes we’ll talk about
here in a second but uh please walk us through that a little bit if you can um well there was another um
rice riot at talladega uh same groups cubans and uh who had been come here on that
that marielito boat lift thing so i’m in my office and the deputy director runs in and said you got to go
to atlanta for what yeah he said you’re going to command the riot that’s the light of starting he said no but you
gotta end it so i jumped on a plane and flew down there and took it over and put together a team we had the hrt was
not there that was kind of a bummer but i had border patrol they did a great job for
me um i had about 20 something fbi swat teams they’re all good
and so we put together a plan we actually got in uh we actually went into the prison during the riot
um we were right inside with them is that a real fearful situation because you got
us real small quarters you got guys backs against the wall who they are ready to
rumble i would imagine well yeah it’s a little bit tense um um i carried a submachine gun and a
suppressed and that night vision stuff so we’re in there with them they came to see us and uh the purpose was we got to figure
out how we can get in because i had to figure out a way to get into a place that they purposely
designed to keep people out yeah keep people in yeah and so we uh we uh did that a guy named leon blakey and i went
in there and we figured how to do it and actually we took a big part of the prison back name know it we just
surreptitiously moved in and all of a sudden we’re there and they go oh [ __ ] um you got insiders in there helping you
out too no how did you get in danny if you minus um talking about that we have special tools that allows us to
cut through really hard things and um it’s sort of like an acetylene but it’s not and we just would go in and
then what we had to be careful is we didn’t leave a hole behind as they come out yeah so it took a lot of cord and the bureau of prisons people were
fantastic yeah i’m a big fan of those guards and things and they were they were wonderful and they helped some of
them were with us um so we actually um we pulled it off and um
we brought in a a priest a catholic priest to talk to them and uh he talked him out of it
so i mean there’s a there’s a video yeah there’s a video of
um them coming out and it was like because there were a hundred hostages in
there oh yeah these guys had these amazing swords they made swords out of bed frames i
still have one of them i’d cut your head off with it oh yeah it’s amazing how many any hostages lost no no we got them
all out you talked about working with the local authorities there what was the most tumultuous time local authorities
you can get as specific as you want just the state or whatever but i i got to imagine you guys come in and
these guys are like no no we’ve got you know like you always see can you talk about that well i would like to not uh
be too specific okay yeah um the feds kind of have a reputation of uh
we give the press releases there’s a funny joke about a competition they kind of i think
it answers your question um there’s gonna be a dog competition atf dog uh dea dog and fbi dog
and the atf dog comes out and he runs around he sniffs around and finds a gun
and so they give him a they give him a biscuit so he’s laying there with a biscuit at his feet then a dea dog comes
in he runs around does his thing and he finds uh he finds a dope and they put his same thing sent him down so the fbi dog comes
in mounts both dogs and then eats all the biscuits and gives a press release and i
love that story yes and it kind of is it true no i don’t think so we try not to do it
like that yeah um you know i worked in new york city for many years with nypd and we had a
great relationship with them they they are the best and i think we’re really pretty good and um
sometimes there’s a contention but you know when it gets down to the level of of the three of us working together mm-hmm it doesn’t matter what the no
it’s the people right because you know our lives depend on each other and um i have a lot of respect for the other
federal agents i think my business partner for a long time a secret service agent and um he he was great asian he was a
great partner for me and we went all over the world taking care of crazy people and yeah we lived through it so i
guess we did okay yeah and as you as you move to finally in one part of your career you moved to dallas with the fbi
department the office there you became the commander in the oklahoma city bombing investigation i i imagine you
had some run-ins with timothy mcveigh after the fact or no i arrested him arrested him but yeah i heard it i saw
that you his his buddy became your your star witness he did yeah that’s an interesting story i’ve not seen my
family in like 13 months because i commanded the division in maryland so the director sent me down
here and of course the bombing occurred and you know my wife had just flown in that night
the night before to buy a house and bring two of my daughters to there and um we’re having breakfast and we see
on tv is explosion oklahoma city my wife really
i said that’s not my division that’s not mine cell phones exist at the time i can’t even remember okay not like
that we had cell phones but they were like bag phones yeah so um i said that’s bob rix’s territory and within
20 minutes the phone is a place called psyoc that’s where they command all the crisis for the world they still do
and um it was a pager actually and i called and they said director sending you to
do your wife look over at and she knows she knows before that goes on no idea what my wife has been
through yeah um first this is kind of interesting the first time we ever she knew what i did
i’m sure you did not know what i did and so we had a date on a friday night and we both had children i had one she
had three and so we were we never got to be alone hardly and so i
i had to call her and said i’ve got to go i’ve got to go on a business trip which was going to south america to
snatch a guy and she said well um why don’t i just get a pizza on hippie pack
okay so she comes to my house and on the dining room table is an mp5 sub machine gun hand grenades body armor gas mask
and she says are we going to war so we’re not going to go and then she said this is classic she
said do you have an iron i said i don’t know why she said well i’ll iron your clothes i said teddy
people i’m going to go see are going to try to shoot me i don’t care if my pants are surprised and uh and she went anyway we got
married anyway and um she in spite of that and she’s been we you know after mcveigh
we had terrace trying to kill her family and actually tried and she she went right through that i mean she just
amazing woman yeah very strong and very smart i’m going to give some applause to that
i have an applause but that’s a great start oh yeah anyway what was what’s your recollection on when you arrived on
the scene in oklahoma city oh yeah for those who are not quite that familiar um i just did a tour of the oklahoma
city bombing museum nbc uh did a a video with me and my wife touring it it wasn’t emmy as a matter of
fact so after this i’m going to get your answer um so the curator for the museum came to
me and said can we talk to you after you do of course so he said when you walked into that place and you
saw that last site were you overwhelmed i said no not at all that’s what we do
they don’t pay us to be overwhelmed they pass to get it done yeah um i went into the command post met with
bob ricks who was on scene commander and we divided up the pie i took i took the bomb
the bomb blast and he took the rest of it and um i’ll tell you what
there’s a lot of energy there the energy of the people who are suffering the energy of the cops the
energy of the fbi agents and the press is all over the place so i i
i got my raincoat and i went i walked over to the blast side to the building from our command post which is two
blocks away i think and it was like a thousand bumblebees it was like
and i thought we got a lot to do here and that was my thought that was my thought process and so i called for my
deputy in here in dallas to come join me because i knew i was going to be busy
and uh we we started and you know the agents solved the case um commanders don’t very much do a lot they keep
people out of your hair i was walking through the command post that next night and an agent who i did
not walk and said boss why are you so calm that’s because i don’t do anything you’re gonna solve this case i’m not
gonna solve it and they did the agents did an amazing job and i had i had mcmahon helicopter two days later and
he went to meet his fate was that the how was he with you if you mind us asking very deferential to me
very deferential answering questions or standing oh no oh no he wasn’t that deferential um
we uh he was in he’d been arrested by a state trooper named charles hanger not having a license plate right
and um he was in jail perry so we we flew up an hrt helicopter
and um we dropped off agents and atf at the site of the car and then i jumped and
then they put me in a police car they took me right to uh perry and when we get there an elderly guy
ellen he’s playing maize now he came up and he said are you boys in the fbi he said yeah
he said if you have any problem with evidence put that boy out the gate we’ll take care of myself we got this we’re
okay so then we approached mcveigh and uh yeah he said the agent said do you know what we’re
here it’s about oklahoma city he said yeah you want to talk no he didn’t so
um i mean cut the chase we put him in because i got i didn’t have a car
he came in the helicopter yeah so um we used the sheriff’s wife’s minivan to put
the most wanted man in america in the backseat of many man we set him in there we we took him out to the helicopter pad
and then um he starts to get out and i grabbed him i said i said tim behave
because if you don’t i’m gonna hurt you he said yes sir i got it and then um we
took off and the one of the one of the agents with him is is a bomb technician he will disarm a nuclear bomb
he’s got more courage than me certainly not that much but he uh he was very nervous
so i asked my deputy why is he so nervous he said well he’s afraid of helicopter rights i said he’ll disarm a nuclear bomb
so the pilot comes to me was one of my tent pilots and he said boss we can go but there’s no doors okay we’ll go
and so the guy’s agent was dave williams he was terrified and so i went over and i put my arm
around his shoulder i said don’t worry about half of helicopter rides and without a crash so that helps
so we take off with mcvay and we’re uh the way you avoid being interdicted and
helicopters fly very low not to go out but very low because you can’t track you so we’re um
the pilot again he he took me a lot of missions on the team he’s climbing like crazy no no put this
thing on the ground we didn’t i don’t think we got seven feet above the ground all the way yeah so this poor agent’s
you know having a heart attack he’s looking at me and giving me the bird and he’s really mad at me but we we got him
there and you know lester’s history they convicted him was that the heaviest thing you’d roll up on to that time in that point in time
magnitude wise just humanity kind of deal well yeah i think it probably was i guess um it wasn’t the
hardest thing i’ve done he was he was an idiot he was not that hard to catch i think the black liberation army guys
were a lot tougher and more difficult to find um atlanta prison right was pretty difficult
uh iran concert was difficult because i’m living with lawyers and working with lawyers yeah fighting with them so i
it’s hard to say yeah do we do you know why timothy did that terrible thing did that ever come out oh
yeah i know exactly why he did it um that was the second plot to blow up the mural building
a group called the covenant sword norm of the lord csa had planned to blow it up ten years earlier and the hrt took
them all down for they could do it so he was trying to fulfill their wish
and take that thing down wow i think the answer to your question as far as heaviness was probably one of the other
things he was part of was the branch davidian issue down in waco texas which i’ve
heard you speak to this and you were you were you were critical a little bit or maybe that’s the wrong word but you definitely thought there
were mistakes made i think i’m speaking right no no i wasn’t there they didn’t deploy me to that thing i was the deputy
at the time and they uh very frankly they the three of us could have arrested mc um
david correct david chris i’m sorry okay we’ve got to wrestle him he’s a [ __ ] and uh you know he’s bitch-slapping him
throwing a card you’re done yeah but atf wanted to do a big social media mail raid and they got
they’re lucky they weren’t all killed and i had friends in that raiding party um these are brave guys
and they did a good job there for given the mission they were given a suicide mission which almost turned into that
so i you know i think it was awful the way their hires set that arrest up that’s what i do for
a living is set up raids and things i did and i think they just did a terrible job and i feel badly for those agents sir
one of the other things you do aside from some of these incredible things we were talking about you handle security for some of the most high pro you have
handled security and you still do for some of those high profile athletes in the country uh tiger woods specifically
we talked about this before the show uh you were telling us a little about how that works but a guy like that who’s so high profile he needs people like you
to keep keep the dangers at bay could you describe how a guy like tiger exists on the tour with that with your help
um well first of all tiger is very headstrong so tiger didn’t always cooperate to the folks i mean he he’s uh
if you’ve seen him play and i’ve seen him play many many times he is about this more strongly focused
person i’ve ever seen in my entire life and i’ve seen some pretty awesome people and so he thinks he’s bulletproof yeah
and it took us a long time to convince them these people will hurt you not purposely but you get 10 000 people
pushing on the fence and you’re behind that fence uh that fence can come over and you get hurt and so finally after we
were with him for quite a while and his dad just come talk to me danny is that boy listen to you said no he listened to
you he doesn’t listen to anybody yeah but we finally i think convinced him that that
you know we were there for him and and um it worked out i mean we kept him out of
trouble um i did not teach him how to drive a car i’ll tell you that but um i have a great deal of admiration
for all the pga tour players they that was a dream job they mean to work with those guys i got to do necklace security
and torino and right down to jordan spieth and ricky fowler and they’re really really good people you would you would love to
sit down and they’d they’d wear you out asking questions about what you do you know really oh yeah oh absolutely they wore me out yeah good lord oh well you
got a pretty interesting background oh yeah yeah how many guys would you need for a guy like tiger or jordan on when
he’s playing typically at a tournament we’d have about a hundred
um not that many would be with him but quite a few would be i would be me my partner and a team of people we’ve
especially selected to be with him wherever he goes and even family we take care of the family too a lot of guys
that look like you know random fans standing around aren’t actually fans they’re there for for oh yeah undercover
cops a lot of those right and they stopped a lot of stuff i mean a lot of things that happened out there nobody
knows about it yeah we’ll never know about it yeah one of the things he did also while all
this is happening in 97 he wrote a book it’s a mama it’s a mamma jamma book it’s a big boy no heroes inside the fbi’s
secret counterterrorism force i’ve read albert a little bit offline and we ordered the book and it didn’t
show up in time for the show we wanted to have it here on the desk but uh that’s that’s a feat in itself
holy that was not easy um my wife convinced me to write that book and she said you
need to write for your kids your kids don’t know who you are they have no idea and so elaine shannon from time magazine
and i were good friends and she called me and said what are you going to do and i said write a book so i want to do it with you
so we did it together she’d written uh the kiki kamarina story she’s quite an author yeah and she did a lot of michael
mann stuff and uh good i was not a good i was a i was a good writer but i wasn’t a
writer that would write something anybody would read yeah i mean i was writing reports and things and um
so we put it together and we did really well with it and i think they made four movies about it wow
so that’s true it says that or it’s at least i’ve read that in the 2008 art movie iron man
use your use the character agent phil coulson is as that’s me that’s you that’s crazy he used a guy after you in
the movie well um hawk oatesby is the writer for marvel right he called me one day and said uh
danny you don’t know me but i know you so no you money so he said um
i’ve read your book i keep your book on my desk when i write dialogue i love your dialogue
and so we at marvel decided to make the the character agent coulson you said well do i get a check no i didn’t
get a check or anything like that but my my kids used to ask when my wife’s students used to ask her is agent
coulson your husband said matter of fact he is that’s great it’s it’s kind of a cool
you know i’m sorry i didn’t read the book and but excuse me it’s got big words okay well that’s a big reason why i don’t venture
into these unchartered territories um but i wanted to ask you
when you lay in bed and i mean you’ve done all this stuff i mean what comes to mind you’re trying to get
get the peace with this world and all of this and is there something that pops up or are you good you know i i have a very
unique ability i can go to sleep anywhere anytime we used to go on missions in the jungle and we’d get to
the objective and it’s pretty tense and they’re going to shoot you and um let’s say for instance that we can’t
launch at nine o’clock we have to wait till ten so we’re laying in the jungle with all the tension and things and i go to sleep
seriously oh absolutely yeah i did it i tell the exo you got it wake me up when it’s time to go i think that’s why
you’re in such great shape at the age i mean yeah i don’t know but anyway he you know
we lay there and we get a word yeah the other other targets are being hit let’s go so he tapped me see
stand by i have control i do the countdown we’d go launch and go to everything i can sleep anyplace and that’s good i
think it’s because i’m not very smart so my mind just goes to sleep immediately well and we’re
trying to get to the end of this thing it’s so hard because there’s so much there you protected bill clinton both bush presidents trump as a civilian juan
mille santos of colombia the vice president president at that time uh
you do a lot of stuff with the terrorist terrorists you have been lost with terrorists and i had two questions of two different groups because i’m not
really that familiar but i’ve heard the name a hundred times but boko haram who are these guys and then antifa oh i’ve
done them everybody’s heard these guys who are these guys i did the security for the president of nigeria i think i’m gonna go back uh good luck jonathan
nigeria is an interesting company the country the southern half is christian the northern half is muslim boko haram
is a terrorist organization and i tried to help their country address those guys
and i don’t think we’re very successful um yeah they’re pretty heavy-handed over there and i think that really hurts them
because they don’t get cooperation from anybody so yeah um i’m going to go back they’ve called me to come back and good luck is
going to come back and be the president again so i’ll go back nice and then in tifo please explain to us who don’t
really understand what’s going on there and how you’re involved well only with regard to protecting people
from antifa antifa i think is should be investigated as a terrorist group and the department of justice at
least this one is not going to do it um they uh anti-anti-fascist is basically what it
is but they’re not they’re they’re provocateurs and the rioting you saw in oregon and seattle and all this stuff
that was all antifa and instead of um opening cases on them we let them go i just command the fbi
division in oregon i did it for about four years and oregon’s a very permissive state it’s
ridiculous my son’s a policeman there and he’s leaving he’s a canine officer yeah
he has a he and his dog atlas patrol part of our world which dog was that in the dog analogy
you gave about the atf fbi oh that’d be oh he’d get the press release
for sure yeah so that’s that’s what it’s all about um if we have a couple seconds sure we have
we have time to finish whatever sure okay bad times are coming to our country we’ve defunded the police nobody wants
to be cops the people want to be cops shouldn’t be cops um i think that in the next period of time
we have this president that we’re going to see critical food shortages critical gasoline shortages
infrastructure is going to go in the toilet and we all need to be careful
um i have briefings with my family all the time about be careful uh we even have food i’m not a crazy
survivalist but i tell everybody i know have plenty of food have plenty of water and
you know if you’re so inclined to have yourself a weapon and be ready be careful with the gas station be careful when you go shopping because
it’s beginning you think that i was one of my questions at the end is do you think all the work you’ve done that ever people like you
have done the world’s still getting more dangerous no doubt clearly because
the world loved the fbi uh the fbi is not very love beloved right now because they think they’ve had
some things they’ve done that because of their directors and i think jim comey hurt us big time
um well by not prosecuting hillary uh i think we’ve lost credibility and we’ve got to figure out how to get that back
you’ve given a lot of lectures at universities tcu included do you enjoy the lecture series i do a lot yeah i i
like it if they’ll disagree i like it if there’s dialogue i don’t want to go in there and say this is how
we do it i want to know what you think about how we do yeah what do you attribute that danger that
rising danger to anarchy marxist i don’t believe that people that claim
to be progressive progressives are i think they’re marxist and i think you see
you see what they’re doing to our society we’re destroying our education system we are subjecting children to things
they should not be subjected to i think it’s all an effort to destroy our our
culture you think it’s happening from within or it’s coming from outside sources
yeah i think it’s right here i think it’s soros people like that um [Music] yeah it’s it’s from within and i don’t
understand people who can become marxist because it doesn’t work you go wherever you want to go and you
just go to go to south america and see where it’s not working there and um it’s it’s a shame i also think i
know this is this is not the kind of program maybe we’re going to talk about this thing you guys do with faith
i think we denigrate people of faith no i don’t i mean i’m a very faithful person um
i think we are getting away from from what the bible teaches us and what we should be doing and the idea that we
ought to take care of each other i think that’s kind of passing by uh not my my circle but
these mark these marxist types danny you said they’re they’ve lost faith they what what is their aim where’s their
goal to disrupt what are they trying to want to implement a marxist society here where the government controls everything
okay look at what’s going on right now now we have a a uh a czar in department of homeland security that’s going to
decide if uh free speech is okay right i just came out yesterday are you kidding me
have you not read the constitution i think they probably answered it they probably have not but um
i think that’s what it is they want to take they want to control marxim is about control it’s not about benevolence
it’s about controlling people you think as we’re getting more further it’s always been kind of fascinating to
me more further technologically advanced we got so much things that technologies do but we’re getting more primitive in
the treating of each other i mean it’s just that’s a great way to put it i’ve never heard it mentioned like i think that’s a perfect analogy technology is
high compassion is very low and i do a lot of work with with schools
who have texting texting issues their kids who are bullying people and you’re a lot more willing to bully somebody on
text in your face face to face you’re a lot more willing to take somebody’s money for unlawful reasons oh yes on
text than face to face or over the you know with all the great i mean really
interesting and wonderful things you’ve done for people saving people saving lives is there something in your life that you’re it’s disappointment or a
failure in your mind um that’s a great question um
i don’t know i think i gave it my all um i did it was we were going to do a tv series once with uh mark wahlberg
and he asked me uh how do you want to be remembered nobody somebody never gave up
yeah and um i got a great family i’ve been many blessings i’ve got great kids
good great grandchildren and i have a lot of good friends i’m i’m very blessed
first of all in my life i didn’t expect to live this long number one number two i didn’t expect to
be this success i’m very successful um they pay us stupid amounts of money to do stupid things
and um i’m grateful for that because i can now pass that on to my church and my kids and my grandchildren yeah i’m pretty
blessed yeah that’s awesome yeah it’s very awesome okay so we always end the show on the uh no family like that’s a
fast rule because b everybody answers family best day of your life family side
oh my son was born that’s family oh we have to discount that answer i’m
sorry i need an adult supervision yeah i married my wife that’s my first family
too well she wasn’t family when i’m here it’s an intentionally hard question it’s very hard um sir you are an fbi agent we
gotta get this right okay um i think today we walked 100 hostages out of the atlanta prison oh
wow there you go that’s a good one yeah what’s the craziest undercover story real quick before we go that you’ve been
part of you’ve been through some sewers you’ve been through some uh prisons you’ve done some a lot of wild stuff what’s the
craziest one in your mind um i think the shootout with twyman meyers
and and the subsequent fight um i initiated the case on him got the warrant for him
and the last association it has when i put him in the door and slammed him shut in the morgue that was crazy indeed
danny coulson thank you for being here thank you captex bank we appreciate you
as well thank you be on the show my friend thank you
