FORTitude FW Where Stories Never Die

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Mac Engel (FW Star-Telegram /

Mac Engel

FW Star-Telegram /

Mac Engel joins the guys at FORTitude. JW and Brinton pick Mac’s brain about high school and college sports. They explore the future of school sports as things continue to change.


Mac is an award-winning sports columnist for the Fort Worth Star-Telegram where he has worked for 20 years. He’s covered the Texas Rangers, Dallas Stars, Dallas Mavericks, and Dallas Cowboys as a beat writer for several years, as well as every major college in Texas. His blog – The Big Mac Blog – was named The Best in Texas by the Texas Associated Press Managing Editors in 2011. He was a delight on the podcast, be sure to give it a listen. 

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Episode Transcription: 

Welcome back people we are FORTitude on today’s show got a one of our own little Horned Frog buddies on it a guy by the name of Mack Engel one of our it’s a second visit to the show thanks coming back Mac. We are much improved set from last time and your audio only version has now become a video and audio so we apologize for not sharing that information with my partner Brinton to my right, we just finished our pre recording argument so we’re back on the same page. We’re ready to roll
Scott I would just like to ask I want you to listen some mac and then being us in the sports journalism area that you are that you just let me know about for free. Thank you very much.
Not a bill.
Let me see what you think about this. As former TCU defensive lineman for Landry Berg died tonight JW it’s an electron this reporting year here the big state national television it’s never seem to faze Gary Patterson’s teams who seemingly played their long intros eyes rolling.
Thank you, Brinton. You’re right about that. This place is tours a fun place to play. I’ll tell you that. Being here back in 96. We had a dueling Jeff Dover upset at John Blake coach team, with the crowd the crowds. One thing I remember more than anything, they’re loud, they’re obnoxious. They want to get in your head. They want to mess with your psyche. They want to mess with your state, your cadence. They’re intimidating, and they know it. And they’re good at it. So you got to take it back to the crowd. But Gary Patterson, he’s known for playing in big games. He’s known for getting these guys ready to play in big games. Agreed. So that all being said, but the crowd I don’t think Gary Patterson’s coach team will be have any problem with this type of crowd, but what an electrical environment it sure is to be in tonight. I tell you what, Gary?
Yeah, yeah, you can’t really win in that situation. I’ve noticed like Britain, if you’re if you haven’t, if you’ve never done it, you’re gonna go well, that’s kind of long. That’s not very good. Well, you go do it. And you’ll be 1000 times worse. Because if you’ve never done it before, you’re like, you don’t realize just how horrible you sound. And I’m sure you guys have gone through this with the show. Yeah, like, Oh my God, that’s terrible. Horrible. Yes. Quit talking. Stop talking. Make the question shorter, whatever it is. Because once like, you were probably nervous when you were on right. At that moment. At that point. I was yeah, you can kind of tell you like, Okay, throw it to him for the first time. And probably by halftime or the third quarter. You were fine. But it takes that first couple of times, like oh, God, I sounded horrible.
And the best thing that right afterwards, too, but I don’t know.
Yeah. Oh, I have. So when I go back and I listen again. That’s terrible. Yeah, that’s horrible. But it’s funny when when JW was talking about that game in 96, I was at that game. That was the first game I ever attended when I worked at TCU. And they won a huge upset, right? They won in Oklahoma and 1000 years and all this other stuff. I thought, Oh, they’re gonna be pretty good. And then they weren’t. And then Pat Sullivan resigned.
I forgot about all those other bad times. Yes. That was a great game, though.
Did you have fun to it was incredible. I
stood next to Holly row for the duration of the game. And I actually I can probably shouldn’t say this too much. But I found out that Trey Hodges Tomlinson, our defensive back was not going to play the second half. And I called up to Brian in the booth saying, Hey, I got some news on this guy. So I told him and actually made the report. And then I see Holly row, looking at Tomlinson on the sideline, kind of wondering what he’s not doing going in. We made eye contact, I felt like I was really part of the media at that point. And I said, and she was kind of motion over to her and she walked over to me, and I said, yeah, he’s out. She was really and I and I said, Yeah, and she goes, that’s a big deal. She radios up to I assume, you know, production straight or somebody and then they broke it on the national news a little while later, so I felt like a really important medium.
That was given too much like or like its MAC does it get into like, what’s my story, though, like, like to do it?
In that case, because people don’t realize the whole sideline reporting thing is a lot harder than it looks because you can’t really do or say that much. Yeah, now in college, you can get away with a little bit more than the pros. You can’t get away with anything. Yeah, they’re there anytime you see one of those sideline reporters, okay, such and such is hurt, he’s out for the game. The NFL has already given them and pre approve that information like that’s we and we get it in the press box. The same time that the sideline reporters getting it. In college, you might have a little bit more luck. If you know the trainer or an equipment guy or maybe the player, you can get a wink and nod something like that. sideline reporting is really hard. There’s I mean, what what questions are you going to ask, right? These guys are mad. They’re coming out at halftime or they’re going into the locker room and half and they’re usually ticked off because cuz something’s gone wrong. And now you’ve got to come up with some dumb question that this guy does not want to stop and have to answer. And to get some sound for 3840 seconds. Yeah. Because that’s been negotiated between the network and the conference. And it’s just content. They don’t say anything. The one who’s gotten really good at it, and I don’t know how you did with Gary, the one who got really, really good at it is Aaron Andrews, because Aaron’s is so much money, and she’s, she’s done it for so long. She’ll ask anything. And if you can ask anything and not be afraid of the consequence, it’s usually okay. Yeah, but if you’re nervous, and you’re worried, Oh, am I gonna make this person upset? You can tell Charlie and it’s tough especially Gary’s wound up tighter than a drum. He’s mad. his team’s getting crushed. Defense can’t stop anybody. What is JW Orlando super diner, anybody in those situations? Gonna ask? Yeah, well, that guy’s not going to get the hell out of my face. I don’t want to talk to you. They don’t. But they do. And you’re just getting in the way.
So man, I
listen, you did a nice job.
I appreciate that. It was it was a quite an experience for me. But before we get into more angle, we’re still in the process of trying to gain followers and gain an audience as you clearly already have. It’s hard. We need to plug ourselves real quick. It’s hard. If you ever want to find the fortitude on the internet, you can find us at YouTube, Apple, Spotify, and Facebook and fortitude. Fw. If you’re want to check out our website, Mac, it’s WWF fortitude. If you want to contact us for the to be in case you ever just wanted I was gonna text you and that was too That works, too. So
questions. Yes. So butchered so generous with me? By insight guy? That’s right. Yeah, I didn’t have to get forgot about that. Thanks to Mac because he’s helped me in many of interviews where I bring up stuff that JW doesn’t think I have any idea about which I don’t
appreciate. That was very clever. I like that. Yes. Thank you. Yes. So let me tell you my Hollywood story. Yeah, please.
So this is kind of the one of the fun things about my job because I don’t make as much money as you guys do. I do get like fun experiences that you can’t quantify. We don’t want that. We’re a photographer like this. Boy, that was that was nice. That was awfully nice of them. Yeah, I look good. That day, guy really fat cheeks. But I’m sitting here looking at all your toys. And I’m like, I got to meet Pat Tillman. I got to talk to Pat Tillman, before he left.
He said he paid me a million bucks if I find if I knew who that was. Yes, he did not have
that. Yeah. So I got to talk to him. But my Holly rose story. So Holly row is on Twitter. And she puts up something in Holly row is a pro who’s very positive is a fierce advocate for sports, and specifically women’s sports, right? So she puts up a picture of something regarding Iowa State Women’s basketball, and I don’t look at it. I just put in some smartass one liner that you really I know. I don’t look at it. But I see something about I don’t even but it was a smartass one line. And it was in light of what it turned out. The picture was that I couldn’t see it. It was rude. Beyond rude. It was totally dumb. So she sends me a message like on direct or something like that, and I can’t remember what she said. But I looked at him like oh my god, it was like it was like a picture of like, girls basketball, like 15 year olds in Iowa or something. And I’m like, Oh my god. So I start calling friends of mine. And I said do you have Holly rose phone number or email address as I got to send her a message to let her know that I this was totally unintentional because if she wanted to in that situation, she could have put that out and said This guy’s a jerk and such and such and I’m like oh man. So finally I get the email from somebody knows her worked with her at ESPN gives me the email address and email I’m so sorry totally unintentional bubble blah blah, blah. And she emails me back. Okay, I understand but you know, and the one thing I give Holly a lot of credit about people in our jobs what happens way too much is you get so cynical especially me where she’s remained really positive and that’s why I’m a big fan of holly road and that yeah,
she was lovely to be around yeah, she’s gonna move in a better bit to have him on the sidelines trying to make sense of that because you’re right it’s hard to come up with stories I didn’t know what to talk about the motivation what are people thinking?
Did she say Did she didn’t she you said that she started talking bad about Mac like there was that just
off the record Yeah. Really fun next I Cagle apology
right that’s what we’re here for.
If if the season continues TCU season continues to go sideways right? You need to put Britain there like find some reason for Landry can’t do sideline and then put Britain in there at sideline let him do it because that would be funny. It would be gold like you’re at least played you have some idea where you put in Britain who doesn’t really isn’t that versed in the language of it. Like I could at least fake my way through me like
questions like hey, where do you get the headset? Yeah, I noticed the courthouse because I want to have these headsets I were distinct. girl coming in, follows you around with the cord. Like what do I get? I don’t know
if we can pull this off, but we’re sure as hell gonna draw.
Patterson that question that you shouldn’t interrupt him during the game. Did you? Like the last album? I don’t remember.
Try to stop. That was 1315 and they ran a draw on they got 20 yards a week. Are you just a week given up? Or should I take off because your team has okay, just you don’t want to not right now. Cool. Go get chapter
J dubs face ready to get Mac
so the funny funny point was, what the heck was he now you made me lose? That’s not my fault. That’s your fault. You get what you pay for. That’s right. Anyway, today’s show we’re going to focus on a high school sports and some of the stuff that’s been happening. A few days ago a story broke about Nolan High School and their use of five ineligible players but the district’s governing body taps taps handed on the punishment and tell the two year suspension the team was was required to forfeit three victories dropping them from five and two overall to now two and three and their district therefore no to two and to the Catholic Diocese in the present Christie Webb suddenly fired the ad. Put the head coach David Bowden on indefinite suspension he’s been there since 2016 had a really good successful record they’re they’re gonna be allowed to compete in the in the playoffs we talked a little bit off off air but they’re gonna still be able to compete. kJ Williams takes over as head coach and Brian Florida is their is their interim ad. That being said, we wanted to kind of get your take on all this because you obviously dealt
with that piece of paper. You’re out there. Look at that guy’s last name God. Yep. I’ve got very bottom of the page. And I
heard that too.
Let’s just talk about Barney in Florida,
Florida. Yeah.
How do you get through high school and middle school with that? You know, you change the call mom and dad like Sorry, I love you guys. But I’m going to Smith.
Now an athletic director, sir, I think he’s a
calm. Imagine the jokes.
I can’t I can’t I don’t even know what to say right now. I’m embarrassed during our friends at Nolan that we love dearly. Now,
what if it was your name? It was right here written right right by this picture this guy.
So first of all, we got two names. So we’ve got Baudin
which is like ls like select Louisiana, right? Yeah. Cajun food. Yeah.
And now we got Fargo Dan usually leads to
sorry, that’s, I can feel my face getting around.
And you know, one thing that JW just said that is a red flag anything before this all our good friends that we love. Anytime you say I love this person. There is a buck coming. Yeah, it’s never good. No, I love mac. He’s great.
But and you know what bud is? It’s the eraser of everything that you put before them right now we’ve changed
to two and a half. Yeah. And she was dead. Love them.
Let me bring this up. Because it’s ironic that Jada did do the reporting at Oh, you which you talk about that? Remember, they like with their quarterback and all of that. So yeah, going back to this. What is going on in sports with these players and individually, like what is happening? And now it’s kind of going down to the high school level. Like
I hate to say and I thought about this a lot and I’m sure you guys have I know you have Britain, you’ve got kids. I mean that I know I’m it’s money. And I think it’s we’re sports is really tricky, because you’ve got to be really careful how you use it. You got Jay Fitzgerald over here. He’s made a career out of it. Not everybody can do that, as well as Jay has done it. And Jay did it at a time in soccer when soccer was way off the map in the United States. Well, now it’s a part of the discussion. It’s, it’s a billion dollar business. You got a viable pro sports league that that works now. Whereas for many generations before, it was failing at best. And my personal feeling is that you know, I’ve got a daughter who’s playing select soccer and I had a lot of concerns about select soccer. I still do I like the people involved and I think a lot of good people are involved in it. I think the money is when you start getting money involved and I’m not talking $10 I’m talking about 1000s of dollars. It changes it changes people just behavior people who don’t mean for it to happen I listened to Hope Solo talk about this. She’s the former United States women national teams goalie and she echoed a statement that I thought for a while which was, you know, the reason why Soccer is the most popular sport in the world, is that it’s basically free. Yeah. All you need is a ball. So hockey is one of the reasons hockey can never get any bigger is that you need ice time ice is expensive. The equipment’s very expensive. Football, the same problem American football or soccer.
So anybody can can afford to play soccer. That’s your that’s your angle there that 2% That’s makes sense. Interesting. He
made his statement about the money changing things. Do you think that happens within the home when all of a sudden the budgets be unoccupied for say $10,000 Go into soccer or Celexa about x like that I
think about I mean, well, yeah, I mean, and hopes point was, and my point was about my criticism of the US Soccer model. No offense j is that we took the cheapest sport in the world. And we somehow managed to make it expensive. Because if you look at all the crap that’s associated with it, kids have to have a warm up jersey, what? What family needs to spend $40, so their kid can wear a warm up jersey, or a bag, or this and it’s 1000s of dollars, and it just adds up? Well, we got to go to a tournament in Michigan, why we’re right here, you have 10,000 million players right here. Why are you getting on a plane and flying to Vegas for a tournament, and I and it creates a wider gap between the haves and the have have nots. And I and I think when an hopes point was the reason why you see some of the behaviors by parents that are so out of control, sometimes, it’s because they’ve spent so much money on it. Yeah. And it feels like their entitles them to have a voice. Right? That’s we’ve seen it in college athletics, you see all these rich Fat Cat boosters, or have a real active voice in athletic departments? Well, what why? Because they’re paying Jimbo Fisher $9 million a year to coach a football team, right? Or they’re gonna pay $17 million just to make adores Iran go away. Well, that sort of stuff eventually kind of filters down on a much smaller level, we’re not talking about millions of dollars, we’re talking about 1000s of dollars, but money is all relative. If that family if that household $1,000 is a big deal to that household? Well, then that’s a big deal. Yeah. And I think we were the part that concerns me is that, and I say this, because I’m going through it now at 48. You can only play sports for so long.
Well, that’s the thing is that have we hit that point with the rise of the all of these select sports, and we’ll and we’re gonna get back as I want to figure out what you think about this. The Nolan deal, too, but real quick. So have we hit the point where all these parents are like, we did this select thing? It didn’t work out for us? I don’t know if I’d put that money in it again, like have we hit that generation? Well, or didn’t look like that?
It? It doesn’t look like that yet. I think that individual has to go through it. And whereas, and I think what I’ve noticed, is parents, if you ask them individually will say this is madness. This is crazy. Why am I doing this? But then you get stuck in like, well, I guess this is what we have to do. We got to spend $2,500, for our child to play soccer
this year. Well, and it’s funny because we have a friend who graduated with whose son plays on a select baseball and he was like, and he was complaining about this. Like, it’s not only that it’s going on these trips, staying at the hotels. And he’s like going out with the parents. Yeah. And he was, it was it’s a first and he’s like, I’m gonna just bring my grill and cook in the parking lot. And I was like, Don’t be that dad, man to your kid. Like don’t? Yeah, Don’t set yourself. Because there’s a pressure. You got to come with us and do this. And this is how we do it more so
than just sports. So Mack, if the parents aren’t throwing the money down for the kid to do this is this is the kid falling behind in his peer group. His friend group isn’t getting kind of ostracized? Because he’s not part of that cool new group that’s doing the good stuff in that in that respective sport. I don’t know. Is that is that issues? Well,
I think you have to think about it. I mean, I’m sure your dad, your that we all are we? We don’t we know how hard it is, even in the best of circumstances. So you don’t want to deliberately put your kid in a spot where you think it may really adversely affect them beyond your own screw ups in a given day. Okay, I we can make this work. Are you sure? Well, yeah, it’s called credit. Okay. Well, that has a price. And I yeah, I worry about it. I know exactly what you’re talking about. And I’ve seen it with hockey. Basketball, certainly basketball, baseball is extremely expensive. Because you feel all this pressure. Well, I gotta go. And then it comes. It hasn’t really for me, and that’s probably more of an indictment on me, but then it becomes the parents life. And I, I’ve seen that happen and where it becomes a big part of their social life. And you hear about all these stories. Oh, we’re going on a trip. You got two nights in a hotel? Parents are it’s peppy, happy drunk party time. Mm hmm. And then the kid finishes. Right, right to graduate high school or they get hurt or whatever. And now the parents like, well, now what? I guess we all go through that sort of stuff. But these are all sort of the things that have come about as youth sports in the United States. And I don’t know what it’s like overseas, but Youth Sports The United States has become multi billion dollar industry.
So enter ni l right. So does that kind of pick up where that stuff that conversation is starting and then you know, all of a sudden Do you have these kids? Because you think about just the kids to just like I played a slick sport my whole life. And now I’m not playing in college, or I am playing in college. And I either need to continue this right. And all of this kind of money and influence that exists. You know, presumably what happened with taps and all this bubble up that took place was based on a recruiting thing. And it’s like how much I mean, right? Now we’re going down into the deep seats, right with the recruiting thing. So it’s like, it’s all kind of happening. And it’s starting to look a lot like politics or some other places, you know, where it’s like, the money is driving the conversation. And so what, what’s your take,
uh, I think the NFL thing is going to become not a crisis. And you know, Eric, I’m in writing. Eric was the longtime athletic director at VMI, Miami of Ohio, TCU, South Carolina and Texas a&m. And Eric was an idealist and a purist. It’s college athletics to the core. And when and I had always been a mind that you can’t pay student athletes, you can’t, because of Title Nine, pay the football player, you have to pay the women’s soccer player, pay the basketball player, men’s basketball player, you’re going to play the women’s swimmer divert the men’s golfer, right. And if you look at most, most college athletic departments, by far and away, the majority of the student athletes are not playing revenue sports, like if you had to break them down by numbers, they’re not playing revenue, sports. And those. And this is the hard complicated part about college sports or sports in general is that even college sports, you only have two sports that make money football, basketball, football, men’s basketball, every now and then you’ll find the random baseball team that might draw some cash and you’ll find the random women’s but I shouldn’t say random that the really good women’s basketball team that will that will that cash positive. that’ll draw money, but talking about a lot of expenses a lot, right. And there’s so much money involved now in on talking Power Five, college athletics, not Sam Houston State, not some division three not have any of that other junk. It’s not that none of them are making money. They’re sort of aspiring to the ideals of higher education, which is we’re here for school and to try to make young people’s lives better to be in a position where they succeed when, after when, after they’re done with college and hopefully become contributing donors. So now, when Eric’s point was a look, if you look at the amount of money being tossed around now, I don’t know how you can not not pay these people. So when he changed his mind, I changed my mind. Like, okay, yeah, he’s probably right. So now you have an IRA that comes down, which I think is probably outdated, which is which as much as I didn’t like it, I think it was a necessity. How many people you really think are going to draw are going to be worth $10,000 $5,000 $100,000? In college sports? Probably not many. Yeah. But if you’re at the University of Alabama, Tennessee, USC, Washington, me your big power state school, and then maybe Duke, men’s basketball, Notre Dame, a couple other privates. You can line up deals with maybe oil and gas guys, because they’re doing it now. But what’s it really, really worth? And I think what you’ll find is for a handful of them, they’ll be worth a lot. The other ones are much
very interesting. So you real quick Mac you touched on the haves and the have nots in your previous comments. But this is something I’ve learned by talking to some folks in college spectrum this NFL stuff and you might know this but in the locker room specifically there’s you have the kids getting to get paid and you have kids not getting paid. So the haves or going to somehow have a place in it table that to have nots won’t Yep, there’s going to be some m&r animosity in the locker room which obviously is no good. Have you heard of this? This?
Yeah, I talked to you guys know who Emanuel ocho was okay manual. I did a zoom call with him not too long ago. But and I’m really good at the name drop by the way. Yeah, they would. I’m still back
on this coach from Nolan’s
we’re gonna do a different show. So I asked him about that because Emanuel like all these guys are very pro and I L. Annual. And he played in the NFL for I think four seasons, and he brought up a really good point. Why do you think all these quarterbacks turn around and give their offensive linemen? $10,000 toys basically are taking care of these guys. Yeah, well, High School. The kid who’s probably shortly you just got out of high school? Is he gonna have the presence of mind to turn around and give his offensive lineman? 10 You know, $5,000 worth of junk? Yeah. Is he probably not? I think it’s yeah, it’s gonna be problem money. I mean, anything you get anytime you get any sort of advancement, let’s just take not technology. There’s some trade off. So these guys are making money. Yeah, there’s gonna be a trade off there gonna be a problem. And I think what you’re gonna find is and I’ve, I think you’re gonna find for a strata of coaches. I think Gary’s one of them. Gary Patterson was one of them. Kirk Pham, just find the older guys and Buddy, 55 and up, they’re gonna have a really hard time with this, because their powers being taken away a little bit. And I don’t know if it’s good or bad. But it’s going to affect families. It’s gonna affect high school coaches. It’s a trickle down thing. And I think what what all eventually see is high school players. You’re like, wait a minute, I’ve got a million Instagram followers, because I’m being recruited by Ohio State, Texas and Alabama. And I can’t make any money off this. Yeah, we’re not doing this. Because why did you think the quarterback from South like, left early to go to Ohio State? So you can make a million dollars in an IPL? Yep. And eventually, eventually, much like the NFL went through with the rookie salary cap, they got tired of paying guys $10 million. Like Sam Bradford was the last guy who got paid. And they were like, Nope, we’re not doing this. Because the veterans were like, wait a minute, why is this cat getting $10 million? And I’m out here making 1.2. And I’m in the league for six years. Yeah. So eventually, that’s all going to happen. It’s not gonna happen today. Probably won’t happen in five years. But it’s gonna happen.
Well, it sounds a lot like the record company, given you in advance, and you do an M five, you know, album contract, and you’ve got to come and put all those albums out. And then their return is on that initial investment when the studio stuff and all that. But the other question I have is because we’ve had some young folks who have said, Yeah, Mom, you know, is this and you think about a parent making a judgment call, if you’re getting a free ride, no matter what, that parents go in with their gut on the emotion that they get from probably that coach and how well that they think their child is gonna be taken care of. Now, it’s a totally different dynamic, right? You’re having, you’re having maybe some folks who are not that educated in some of these business decisions and reading contracts and things like that. making these decisions.
Yeah, you do. And I’ve come to learn that if a college athlete and I don’t know if you went through this JW or Jay, you went through this. A college a high school athlete I
played in college, you all right? Yeah.
I mean, it’s the same. How dare you not Did you sign when you came out of high school player is not signing with a college. He’s signing with a coach. Surely their allegiances
to the coach moist on an emotional thing now with based on the whatever they
promised, and this guy’s going to help him get better and all this other stuff? You know, if you find that the the troubling thing is that, and especially when I listened to Brett Kavanaugh, the Supreme Court justice when they were ruling about all this stuff, is a Brett Kavanaugh basically said a college education is not worth anything. Now, that’s a really dark way to interpret your ruling. But if you read it, you’re like, yeah, the Supreme Court justice. This one who was a benefactor of some of the most elite schools in the United States, ie wealthy is saying this isn’t worth anything. Because a scholarship a full ride, say it’s TCU or SMU, that’s basically three 250 to $300,000. It’s not worth anything. It’s not. That’s what he was basically saying, which we all know is a lie. Well, what’s the university selling? That this is, you know, worth $300,000 or $80,000 a year or whatever it is. So when he said that my job out hit the floor. And what I’ve learned, especially now in the last 10 years, when college and high school athletes are going through recruiting unless it I shouldn’t say all of them. But in terms of the revenue, sports, things like that baseball to maybe track are not asking about school. School never comes up. They’re not asking about well, we look at look at the geology department, we’ve got the best communication department in the southwest, our business schools right now. They’re not asking about any of it. It is about playing time am I going to play? How much am I going to play? Where do I fit in? Those are the questions, and that’s fine. But someone, someone in that dynamic has got to stop these guys and saying, listen, dude, this is going to end. At best. If everything goes right. You’re done with this life at 35. Mm hmm. Most of you ain’t money making money on this at all. And a lot of you are going to quit halfway through. Mm hmm. No one brings that up. Interesting. Yep.
How much does the conference then dynamic play? Because now it’s like a lot, we as a school, better get into the right conference. So we get the right. It’s like the other side of that equation, right? Where it’s like if we’re not, if we’re not big time enough, we’re gonna lose all these players that
well, it’s not just players that you’re losing. I mean, that’s, that’s part of it. Coaches, all of it donors. I mean, if you look at go back to the 80s when Georgetown University, not many people outside the Northeast had heard of Georgetown University. remember some of those players players, you didn’t know is a private key. you name one of them. I can
seek Casey Jones because it was grateful that song is that right? That’s coach Casey Jones. Yeah, dude, I
hope Georgetown basketball
I don’t I don’t believe exactly that’s yes, we can. I’m gonna Google
it was John Thompson. Casey Jones, the coach the Boston Celtics, because Larry Bird,
keep going, yeah. No, let
him Let him versus another couple of weeks why he’s finding out his error.
Okay, so let’s talk about like Georgetown. Georgetown was a small private, Catholic University in the Northeast that was known in the northeast, Irish John Thompson, you recruits Patrick Ewing, David Wingate, all these other guys. They started killing in the national NCAA tournament. They become a national brand. Then you had polio paranoia and all of a sudden the donation started to flood it. It’s it happens every time it happened to Northwestern when the football team started to do well in the 90s and happened to TCU. It happened to Colgate, a small private liberal arts school and they recruited a kidney MacDonald Foyle would never have gone to Colgate to get to the tournament, money and application start flowing in. So now that Baylor Baylor sits another one, they all that’s why they’re all chasing that ghost. If we can win in men’s basketball, if we can win in football, which is the holy grail, we will completely change. The fortune of this university happened down the street to heart, George Mason. I remember when George Mason gotten in the funnel for a couple of years ago, all of a sudden, all this money that had been on the news, maybe on the maybe for George Mason to spend, they get to the Final Four. Done.
You get guys like me buying jerseys out of George Mason t shirt Terry t shirt ago. You’re exactly right. Hey, Brittany, what do we come up with?
That? My algorithm did show that Casey Jones had a small stint coach and Georgetown when I didn’t look that far.
The interviewer had to google something during the interview. Okay, good. You mentioned
Ryan Pardo was his assistant coach at that time.
I mentioned Jimbo Fisher just a second ago you just penned an article a couple days ago about this this exact situation real quickly is Jimbo Fisher leaving a&m for LSU I
might you never know Do you believe anything? I love so Jimbo was under Nick Saban. When Nick Saban was a
Jimbo Fisher has been Patrick Donahue play for
Georgetown. He did he was a guard Okay, off the bench. I slowly
redeemed myself yet but the dude who Jimbo Fisher is by chance? No clue. Okay, I got a I got a vision of Patrick Donahue right now. Not right, fair enough.
Sir General Fisher’s head coach, Texas a&m, he was at Florida State and won a national championship. He left in 2014 17 Whatever it was, because the athletic director of Texas a&m was a big splashy name guy and he goes out and hires a national championship winning coach for like seven years and $75 million. Here’s the best part. That whole contract was paid for by boosters. None of it was state money. None of it was a an AMS money. It’s all a bunch of jock stuff, and dorks who threw money at Jimbo Fisher and then you’re not gonna believe this. Jimbo Fisher loves Texas a&m. I had no idea. I came he loves Texas a&m. And here’s the here’s this even gets better. Jimbo. Last season during COVID goes nine and one doesn’t get into the playoffs, which they’ve got the shaft and then like Jimbo, you’re amazing. You’re incredible. Here’s more money. We’re gonna bump your salary from 7.5 to $9.2 million. You’re going to be the second highest paid coach in college football only behind Nick Saban even though you have not gotten to the playoffs that’s how much they love Jimbo Fisher
He’s He’s not lying it’s unbelievably crazy how much they like
this the Aggie but they that’s a whole different deal man that they love like it’s a different it is that they take good care their own. I will say that they know. Yeah, even now,
dollars a year to not be Nick Saban. But to be mean to be paid like Nick Saban and not produced like him?
What would it cost them to lose to lose? Jimbo Fisher my favorite part?
That contract has a $0 buyout. Wow. Right? Nothing. Nothing if normally there’s a buyout in every single big time contract. Because the whole point is you leave you’re paying us. So I think it’s a big reason why Jamie Dixon is not the head coach at UCLA right now. He’d say that’s not true, but I don’t believe that respectfully. So Jimbo, who Who’s the one who wrote the contract between Texas a&m? Jimbo Fisher Scott Woodward, who’s the athletic director at LSU. Scott Woodward, who just negotiated a get out of town contract with Edwards, Ron Scott Woodward, who has relationship with Jim Jimbo Fisher, Scott Woodward.
any relation to Woodward and Bernstein? Yes,
he’s a conkel It’s crazy out worked out. It’s
like, good, good writer. Yeah, presumably.
Everybody’s thinking well, Scott’s gonna come after Jimbo again and he can do it because it won’t cost Jimbo any money. I don’t believe that I think Jimbo will stay there forever because they just gave him $9 million a bump from 7.5 to $9.2 million. He’s like, Oh, I love it here love my family loves here. We’re gonna do our stuff with our foundation and all this other stuff. Like, who cares? They’re giving you $9 million. I love it here and a&m. They don’t have enough words in any dictionary to express their love for this guy. And I’m thinking, yeah, he loves you because you’ve just paid him 9 million you give me nine? Yeah.
College Station, the cost of living. There’s probably you probably live in like you’re getting paid 15 million.
What do you do with it? Like, I want to know what do you do with it with $9 million in exports? I guess that’s right. He’s on the best team. So Jimbo, I don’t think Jimbo will go anywhere. But I need to be dumb not to call not to take the call. Oh, you want to chat? I bet you guys I don’t want to leave. I love them. I love all you guys were they’re asking me and oh, you bump me up to 10.3 Are All Right on. Okay, I wasn’t gonna go but I’ll take the money.
Alright, so we’ve consternation about all of this. You can’t take the money out of the machine. So what do you do you regulate it? I mean, this is like back to the capitalism kind of, I mean, do you limit the market? Or what do you do? Just let it happen? I mean, we have a lot of things in life facing us like this, you know, do you just let
us know what they’ve tried to do? The one way you sell sports, because you got to sell it. It’s one of the reasons the college football playoff is gonna go from four to 12. You’ve got to sell interest in your games, right? What they realized quickly was four teams isn’t enough. So they’re gonna go to 12 teams. And by giving it to 12 teams, they’re basically going to turn a college football playoff berth into an NCAA tournament berth, which is okay. It’s interesting enough.
This is football. Is there enough recovery time, like even there’s like they don’t care. Okay. Yeah, they’re 20 getting paid. Now, who cares? Right, who
cares? Is it recovered? No, of course not. Well, there is better 20 than there’s 30
Well, but I mean, the whole the kind of deal with the march but it’s like a compressed thing. Right. Well, I attention you know, if you do it over three months, you lost me, you know, in the first week.
It depends on a are you gambling be? Are you a football junkie? See, are you invested in the team?
How do the bookies know those spreads so close?
The best of the best fans on the planet? And because they research like nobody else? It’s just amazing how good they are. It’s
amazing know our Horned Frogs better than we know our Horned Frogs. Probably I
mean, go back to the Rose Bowl. Right? It was like two and a half point favorite. And when they went by 243 I think was it 321 19? Is it three? Yeah, it’s two, two. Yeah, that’s two Excuse me. All right. Well, as math was good at it, it’s uh, yeah, right, clean that one up?
Oh, so how do you clean the machine? Okay. You don’t know, I
think I think maybe you guys have gone through this, too. This is what the rules are. I think it’s up to you, as a parent, as a dad, as a man, a human being, like, Okay, I kind of have to figure this out and try to make it work as best for me as I can. And, you know, sometimes that means recognizing not knowing what you don’t know, and finding somebody who does. You know, I know personally, like, I’m not that smart. And I’m not that dumb. But I know, when it comes to money. I’m going to call my brother or my dad. When it comes to certain other questions I would have about things of, you know, doctor, some medical issue. I have a sister in law as a doctor, I have a lot of friends who I’m going to ask them. Yeah, so when it comes to it, the trick is, can you find the right person to sort of give you a heads up and advice on it? Who has your best interests at heart? And is it looking to take your money looking to take your time? I think for for a lot of people. It’s hard to figure out. Yeah, especially when it’s your kid involved. That’s your heart, right? Yeah. That’s they’ve, a kid has your entire heart and they’re in your in their poem. They don’t know it, but they do. And you want the best for them. You want them to hurt you want them to be in a good spot, but you also and I also go back to this we talked about youth sports. I think what really drives me crazy and this comes from talking to quote pro coaches, pro coaches, Division One coaches. Dr. James Andrews, the legendary sports orthopedist, out of Birmingham, Alabama. I’ve talked to him about this. That’s good name drop. Excellent. It’s like don’t worry about any of this stuff until the child finishes puberty. Don’t worry about college don’t like you don’t know. Make sure they have fun, get a little bit better. Learn some life skills, stay in shape, burn some calories, all that stuff, have fun. They’re not sitting in front of the computer all day, all that. That’s what I focused on. And I thought okay, whenever she would then do regarding my daughter, whenever she’s done with puberty, and I’ll see where she is, but I’m not. I’m under no illusion just because I know the statistics are so so bad. Yeah, it’s use use athletics for what it can be maybe. Who knows, maybe get lucky. You can use it for a scholarship. Who knows. But if you’re going to sit there and think, Okay, it’s about money. And I really need to worry about scholarship assistance. Where’s my better play? A 3.95 GPA? Yeah, that’ll serve you much better than a 395 batting average. And that’s it, but the promise is boring. Sports are fun. Yep. Yeah. You know, it’s unfortunate,
but you are telling the truth. Yeah. So speaking of kids, it’s Halloween season. As you can see, we have adorned our set with some some Halloween accoutrement. What’s the angle family do the homing guy what are you what are you? What are the angles do for Halloween?
You get decorated the house stuff? Yep. I like you like scaring Pete. He likes like him. Man. He has a haunted house that’s Dishonored us. Well, we
we’ve had in the past. Yes. Wow. I know a
guy who went over to that haunted house. Real straight arrow guy. He’s like, he came out with like a live chainsaw. Like he was fearful of his children getting hurt. Because well now I
guess the chainsaw can’t be a surprise. You know, somebody just blew my cover.
I went as a lifeguard is I’ve changed it up. I goes Indiana Jones once and when is Batman one so when is the best one I probably had was it was pretty scary. I went as Jason Okay. Oh, yeah. But I had an axe. I didn’t want to buy a fake axe because I had an axe in the
garage. What’s Kevin Bacon in that first one?
I think yeah, probably like Kevin Costner. No, no, but Kevin Costner played a corpse Josie is there I love
it. We ready to Yeah, hit him up.
A little question. This is kind of like a Fort Worth 14 Point analysis kind of thing. Okay, ready? Yep. No, Jyoti’s are the original. It was supposed to be kind of lightning round, but take your time.
I’m trying to think of the best way to say neither.
You can say no. I
can say neither some What’s the last amount to the original I paid a hefty price for at least a week haven’t been the same set. Okay,
Kincaid or Fred.
Oh, Kincaid.
The modern or the Kimble? Kimble, Sichuan or Tokyo cafe. Tokyo Cafe Homer? A date with JW Britton? Yes. Excellent. bakingo. Thank you
very much. Do me a favor next. Let me know if this is gonna be like a video. So I shave. Yeah, that’s cool. Thanks. Thank you. Thank you.